My first experience with a computer as a child was putting a floppy disk labelled "King's Quest" into an IBM PC XT when my dad wasn't around. And now I'm on this forum.
I am not a huge fan of the IBM PC. For one, it was a mediocre design. Most important, it caused a mass extinction in the small computer space so that, even today, the majority of desktop computers out there are distant descendants of the original 5150. They probably have a complete 5150 inside them, just for compatibility with ancient software.
What the IBM PC provided was a standard on which competition was unleashed and massive investments went into improving a common platform. Which is how all the closed proprietary alternatives got overwhelmed. Without it, we would have many weak walled gardens incompatible with each other, like we have on the smartphone market.
Listen to Linus Torvalds when he says that the PC is so easy compared to the nightmare of all those incompatible arm SOCs.
> What the IBM PC provided was a standard on which competition was unleashed
Entirely accidental. What really started this was the reverse engineering of the BIOS. This allowed any company to enter the market with a PC-compatible computer. IBM tried, but clean-room proved to be an effective defense.
> Without it, we would have many weak walled gardens
Kind of. There were Apple II clones with varyingly clever schemes around copying the original ROMs, and it provided slots so many manufacturers could provide hardware for the machines. Microsoft was one of them, with a Z-80 card that allowed the II to run CP/M software. Atari had a serial bus that allowed external expansion - less popular than the II, but still allowed other manufacturers to expand it. And let's not forget the ubiquitous S-100 bus, with hundreds of different companies making hardware for. In 1983 you could assemble a computer around your choice of processor, graphics (or not), IO, mass-storage, and so on.
> incompatible with each other
Kind of. Prior to MS-DOS, CP/M was the de-facto 8-bit standard for business computers. It had a multi-user version called MP/M, and versions for processors other than the 8080/85 and Z-80. In the higher end, Unix-compatible small computers started to appear - the TRS-80 model II could get a 68000 board, for instance.
It was a mediocre design, but it came with superb documentation for every bit of hardware and software in it, including the source code for its BIOS and all the hardware details of the peripheral and expansion interfaces.
I wish this had remained true for its descendants.
Ah jeez, that makes me feel old. It’s particularly impactful as my dad worked in the computer industry at the time of the transition and the firm he worked for were a little late to the game. They limped on for years but ultimately failed.
I would assume every good one would know IBM mainframes still run the world. And POWER processors are the second coolest ones (second to the mainframe ones).
That is the certificate I earned upon completing community college. Their Linux curriculum was originally designed around Debian, but when IBM acquired RHEL, redesigned to offer this foot-in-the-door.
IBM still seems to do alright in the legacy mainframe/mini market. It is quite strange how the AS/400 and zOS stuff all goes without notice of ordinary IT guys like me, as if it didn't exist, but still powers a lot of machine rooms that aren't AI data centers.
A lot of old mission-critical banking or commercial software systems have been running on those machines for decades. Before the AI age, it'd seem impossible to migrate those programs off. Now with the AI help, there might be a glimpse of hope.
Honestly, a lot of it was not that hard to port if you really wanted, it's just that the ROI of replacing the entire stack including physical machines was not necessarily good. The parts where ROI was good got replaced already.
They come with very fast inference in the core processors as well. Telum is a very impressive family of chips. Their cache architecture is pure madness.
When you need to do fraud detection with extremely low latencies, this is the way to go.
I learned BASIC in 1981 on the TRS-80 Model I with 4k RAM (later upgraded to a massive 16k), and it wasn't long before someone showed me EDTASM [1], and I was hooked. My parents couldn't believe me when I asked them to buy "How to Program the Z80" by Rodnay Zaks [2]. They were shocked, it was the first time I asked them to buy a technical book. I was so excited I couldn't sleep for days. I was in High School, and I would carry the book around and read, use the lookup tables, and write Z80 assembly in my spiral-bound 8.5"x11" notebook.
One three-day weekend, I slept about 4 hours while I was disassembling the BASIC ROM to find nuggets I could call in my Z80 programs, and also to learn so much more about the video, the cassette interface, interrupts, etc. My notebook looked like something a madman had scribbled on the walls of an asylum to everyone around me, but to me it was perfectly organized, and I used it to reference things I would use later in my programs. I got to the point where I could read the hex dumps and "see" the op codes in my mind; people would look over my shoulder while I was debugging, and I'd be explaining what the code was doing, but I hadn't disassembled it yet. I didn't even realize I was doing that until one of my classmates pointed it out: "Hey, disassemble that. I'm not following you, how the heck do you see that?"
And all of this because my science teacher had that TRS-80 Model I sitting in the corner of his classroom gathering dust; nobody knew what it was, I didn't either, but I had to figure it out. I've always had this bug, I don't believe in magic, I want to know how everything works, it's been an insatiable thing all my life, that first machine set me on a course of learning for the rest of my life.
Thanks, Mr. Kruzan, you changed my life. I'll never forget you. Oh, and thanks to all the people who created the Z80, the TRS-80 Model I, and paved the path for me to learn computers and never stop learning.
We are truly building on the shoulders of giants; every generation, more giants. It's humbling to look back and think about it forty-five years later...
I learned BASIC in 1985 on an Apple II, and 6502 machine language in 1987, while in high school. I was able to publish a 6502 machine language program on a national computer magazine that year. Back then we printed the hex code of the program on paper, along with some explanation, then mailed it to the magazine. The magazine stuff manually typed in those hex code on the computer, and if they thought it worked well, they'd just publish hex code of the program and the explanation. Interested readers would then just typed the hex code into their computer to try it out.
The publication validated that programming was something I liked and was good at, which became the main factor I chose computer major in college.
Great story, I am wondering if nowadays this kind of being hooked on in any kind of technology is possible. Kids have ipad style computers or smartphones which are not really hackable. There are things like Scratch, which provide kind of easy access to programming, but that's not the same thing (or maybe I am just old and miss the old times with Atari ST and IBM PC clone with 486DX processor).
For me it was the Commodore 64 from a few years later (1982, I think?) - that's what got me into computers. Back then, to me and my nerdy friends, the C64 felt sorta like a 'rebel computer'; we weren't doing Lotus 1-2-3 or anything practical at all. We were just tinkering, mostly war dialing and pirating games. The C64 was cheap enough that broke-ass kids like me could afford to do the same shit the Apple II and TRS-80s were doing.
My first experience with a computer as a child was putting a floppy disk labelled "King's Quest" into an IBM PC XT when my dad wasn't around. And now I'm on this forum.
I guess it worked out in the end.
I have a framed copy on my office wall of this story from the NY Times, August 13, 1981: https://www.nytimes.com/1981/08/13/business/business-digest-...
I am not a huge fan of the IBM PC. For one, it was a mediocre design. Most important, it caused a mass extinction in the small computer space so that, even today, the majority of desktop computers out there are distant descendants of the original 5150. They probably have a complete 5150 inside them, just for compatibility with ancient software.
What the IBM PC provided was a standard on which competition was unleashed and massive investments went into improving a common platform. Which is how all the closed proprietary alternatives got overwhelmed. Without it, we would have many weak walled gardens incompatible with each other, like we have on the smartphone market.
Listen to Linus Torvalds when he says that the PC is so easy compared to the nightmare of all those incompatible arm SOCs.
I dream of a smartphone PC.
> What the IBM PC provided was a standard on which competition was unleashed
Entirely accidental. What really started this was the reverse engineering of the BIOS. This allowed any company to enter the market with a PC-compatible computer. IBM tried, but clean-room proved to be an effective defense.
> Without it, we would have many weak walled gardens
Kind of. There were Apple II clones with varyingly clever schemes around copying the original ROMs, and it provided slots so many manufacturers could provide hardware for the machines. Microsoft was one of them, with a Z-80 card that allowed the II to run CP/M software. Atari had a serial bus that allowed external expansion - less popular than the II, but still allowed other manufacturers to expand it. And let's not forget the ubiquitous S-100 bus, with hundreds of different companies making hardware for. In 1983 you could assemble a computer around your choice of processor, graphics (or not), IO, mass-storage, and so on.
> incompatible with each other
Kind of. Prior to MS-DOS, CP/M was the de-facto 8-bit standard for business computers. It had a multi-user version called MP/M, and versions for processors other than the 8080/85 and Z-80. In the higher end, Unix-compatible small computers started to appear - the TRS-80 model II could get a 68000 board, for instance.
There was an industry standard before IBM PC, based on Z80 S100 and CP/M
It was a mediocre design, but it came with superb documentation for every bit of hardware and software in it, including the source code for its BIOS and all the hardware details of the peripheral and expansion interfaces.
I wish this had remained true for its descendants.
Some of it did. They are still mediocre ;-)
I love the keyboard casually hanging off the desk like it’s not 20lbs!
time to boot up some Lode Runner.
Ah jeez, that makes me feel old. It’s particularly impactful as my dad worked in the computer industry at the time of the transition and the firm he worked for were a little late to the game. They limped on for years but ultimately failed.
My first pc ran CP/M
I wonder what the average CS grad thinks of these days when they hear the company name "IBM".
"I guess we'll need to learn how to program those quantum computers in the end"...
Might be something like "IBM? What's that?"
I would assume every good one would know IBM mainframes still run the world. And POWER processors are the second coolest ones (second to the mainframe ones).
It's been said that when Microsoft started to grow - say, in the mid-80s, Bill Gates' biggest fear was that it would turn into IBM.
> Bill Gates' biggest fear was that it would turn into IBM.
Good news, it did not. It is worse.
Quality was always a challenge for Microsoft.
And they haven’t.
They are trying. They even make quantum computers that are in a superposition state, working and not working at the same time.
Red Hat Enterprise Linux
That is the certificate I earned upon completing community college. Their Linux curriculum was originally designed around Debian, but when IBM acquired RHEL, redesigned to offer this foot-in-the-door.
IBM still seems to do alright in the legacy mainframe/mini market. It is quite strange how the AS/400 and zOS stuff all goes without notice of ordinary IT guys like me, as if it didn't exist, but still powers a lot of machine rooms that aren't AI data centers.
A lot of old mission-critical banking or commercial software systems have been running on those machines for decades. Before the AI age, it'd seem impossible to migrate those programs off. Now with the AI help, there might be a glimpse of hope.
Honestly, a lot of it was not that hard to port if you really wanted, it's just that the ROI of replacing the entire stack including physical machines was not necessarily good. The parts where ROI was good got replaced already.
System z machines come with special AI processor modules these days, so it's clear IBM wants a piece of that pie also.
They come with very fast inference in the core processors as well. Telum is a very impressive family of chips. Their cache architecture is pure madness.
When you need to do fraud detection with extremely low latencies, this is the way to go.
"I haven't heard of that LLM model, how is it?"
Apple II home computers and TRS-80 are 48.
I learned BASIC in 1981 on the TRS-80 Model I with 4k RAM (later upgraded to a massive 16k), and it wasn't long before someone showed me EDTASM [1], and I was hooked. My parents couldn't believe me when I asked them to buy "How to Program the Z80" by Rodnay Zaks [2]. They were shocked, it was the first time I asked them to buy a technical book. I was so excited I couldn't sleep for days. I was in High School, and I would carry the book around and read, use the lookup tables, and write Z80 assembly in my spiral-bound 8.5"x11" notebook. One three-day weekend, I slept about 4 hours while I was disassembling the BASIC ROM to find nuggets I could call in my Z80 programs, and also to learn so much more about the video, the cassette interface, interrupts, etc. My notebook looked like something a madman had scribbled on the walls of an asylum to everyone around me, but to me it was perfectly organized, and I used it to reference things I would use later in my programs. I got to the point where I could read the hex dumps and "see" the op codes in my mind; people would look over my shoulder while I was debugging, and I'd be explaining what the code was doing, but I hadn't disassembled it yet. I didn't even realize I was doing that until one of my classmates pointed it out: "Hey, disassemble that. I'm not following you, how the heck do you see that?"
And all of this because my science teacher had that TRS-80 Model I sitting in the corner of his classroom gathering dust; nobody knew what it was, I didn't either, but I had to figure it out. I've always had this bug, I don't believe in magic, I want to know how everything works, it's been an insatiable thing all my life, that first machine set me on a course of learning for the rest of my life.
Thanks, Mr. Kruzan, you changed my life. I'll never forget you. Oh, and thanks to all the people who created the Z80, the TRS-80 Model I, and paved the path for me to learn computers and never stop learning.
We are truly building on the shoulders of giants; every generation, more giants. It's humbling to look back and think about it forty-five years later...
[1] https://www.trs-80.org/edtasm.html
[2] http://www.z80.info/zip/zaks_book.pdf
I learned BASIC in 1985 on an Apple II, and 6502 machine language in 1987, while in high school. I was able to publish a 6502 machine language program on a national computer magazine that year. Back then we printed the hex code of the program on paper, along with some explanation, then mailed it to the magazine. The magazine stuff manually typed in those hex code on the computer, and if they thought it worked well, they'd just publish hex code of the program and the explanation. Interested readers would then just typed the hex code into their computer to try it out.
The publication validated that programming was something I liked and was good at, which became the main factor I chose computer major in college.
Great story, I am wondering if nowadays this kind of being hooked on in any kind of technology is possible. Kids have ipad style computers or smartphones which are not really hackable. There are things like Scratch, which provide kind of easy access to programming, but that's not the same thing (or maybe I am just old and miss the old times with Atari ST and IBM PC clone with 486DX processor).
Yeah. Thank you Mr. Pierson for lending me the TRS80 Basic manual, even though I wasn't enrolled in the class that used them...
For me it was the Commodore 64 from a few years later (1982, I think?) - that's what got me into computers. Back then, to me and my nerdy friends, the C64 felt sorta like a 'rebel computer'; we weren't doing Lotus 1-2-3 or anything practical at all. We were just tinkering, mostly war dialing and pirating games. The C64 was cheap enough that broke-ass kids like me could afford to do the same shit the Apple II and TRS-80s were doing.
It is one of those things, yes they are old but they also aren't that old considering the impact personal computers have had on everything.